I think we need to be honest about the actual context and meaning. We’ve seen what happens when presidents lose the election and refuse to concede. It happened with Bush Jr, and it happened with Trump. When Joe tells us that he wouldn’t do what they did, we shouldn’t be upset at his honesty. We should be happy that he’s not evil.
This was in response to it being pointed out that he has an incredibly low approval rating and other members of the party have asked him to step down. And how would he handle all of the countries worst fears coming in January.
This wasn’t some question about concession policy. This is him refusing to listen but also not giving a shit as long as he feels like he deserves the power more than anyone else.
Nah it’s that hes been around politics and knows changing horses mid stream is guaranteed failure.
Period end of story. Change candidates to some no name non incumbent snd and you definitely lose. Run Joe and we may win.
No you are now adding context of what you simply want not reality.
You’re lone idea reality is not the only one that exists. If you don’t know other candidates it doesn’t mean they don’t exist.
You are giving up and just want the easy option even if you don’t even think it will work without forcing others to do something they don’t want to do.
Period. End of story.
Got bad news for you bout most doctors.
What a shit take that doesn’t equate
How did you take Biden saying he’d only step aside if the Lord Almighty came down, and that when confronted with being behind in multiple polls by 7 points that he’s fine if he loses as long as he tried his best?
It’s a dumb take because it doesn’t make any sense. I mean you’re talking about a position where the person can (and has multiple times) literally die on the job and someone will just step in and pick up where they left off. This example makes it seem like if the president dies or even just loses the presidential race then so does every person in the country or something lol.
I get the spirit of what they’re trying to say and even lrgely agree with it but it’s just a super bad analogy.
So let’s go with the convicted felon doctor who only saves the patients who donate millions of dollars to him. The hospital fired him but he refused to leave his office.
But there is only two people in the country rich enough to pretend to be doctors and the whole country is like: this is normal, and you like the racist one or whatever the other one has to offer.
Fucking 👌
You can’t do that because in this attempt to manufacture outrage, the convicted felon doctor doesn’t exist.
You see- they can’t help Trump get elected if they include him in their disaster scenarios.
Fantastic! More propaganda from return2ozma. What a typical day on lemmy.
i wonder if you’ll ever see the similarities between trump’s camp and biden’s. yaknow how he has folks who love him no matter what he does and says, right?
its ok to not like biden or be unhappy if he says shit you dont like. its also a good thing for democracy. If you were only exposed to the pro biden propaganda every day you wouldn’t even know he did or said these things. If everyone thought exactly as you do there would be no nuance.
Ozma’s hard-on for biden memes doesn’t mean theyre a psyop, thats the dumbest fucking idea ive ever heard someone say with a serious face on lemmy. like embarrassingly stupid.
And embarrasingly useless. I’ve seein ozma around and no matter how many times you say he’s a propagandist he will not stop. You and your ilk will never stop whinging about people who say things that attack your fragile world-view.
Not that you and your friviolous friends i see crowding ozmas posts will ever engage in self-reflection.
Their fear of Trump clouds their critical thinking skills.
This comment makes it seem like you have zero exposure to politics outside of Lemmy/Reddit echo chambers. It also makes you look like a fucking idiot.
I’ve noticed the hottest takes usually come after a thread has cooled. Would you care to tell me how i seem ignorant? I would like to come across as learned in your eyes. Please advise if you have content behind your words, with your point. Or are you afraid of exposing your own lacka acumen?
The idea that trumps cult is anything comparable to Biden supporters is absolutely the most insane shit take.
You can’t be serious.
Deadly serious. Would you like to go into it more with me to see what i mean, or is this comment a statement of your final thought on the matter?
Man you are such a psyop.
Running around telling everyone that the only option is to run the poorly polling candidate.That his loss is “possible but oh well, only one option”.
Man Russia is taking a weird strategy to get their pick in these days.Bruh, you’re talking about supporting project 2025 and literal fascism.
Shut the fuck up.
Jesus fucking Christ it’s not complicated.
“Wah wah Biden is tired, let’s elect Hitler”. Fucking dumbasses.
“If Biden stays in the race, he will lose to Hitler”
“ZOMG YUO WANT HITLER?!??!?!”
What you don’t seem to realize is how politics works. Everyone running around regurgitating what they saw some headline say and screaming in panic that they’re going to lose will make them lose.
You want to know why Trump supporters rally around him no matter what? It’s not because they’re idiots (though most are), it’s because they actually understand the importance of projecting strength as a collective and using that to shape a narrative into reality.
Yes Biden fucked up at the debate, but you know whats actually causing him to lose support? Everyone talking and publishing articles about him sounding hoarse and that meaning he has to quit, non stop. They’re not doing it because they have anyone else they think can actually beat Trump, they’re doing it because it made them scared and now they’re panicking and turning it into a self fulfilling prophecy (and in many cases, because they have an article quota to fill and they can capitalize on audiences feeling nervous after the debate by feeding that fear to get clicks in the most bombastic way).
Biden seemed old. Trump seems old literally every week. No one is watching that debate and changing their mind to vote for the mean forgetful lying pervert geriatric who shits himself over the geriatric.
What you don’t seem to realize is how politics works.
Christ, this shit again. Every last time a centrist gets called out on their bullshit, they pull out this gaslighty chestnut.
Everyone running around regurgitating what they saw some headline say and screaming in panic that they’re going to lose will make them lose.
Sure. It’s not like you were gonna blame anyone but the left when a neoliberal earns a loss. We warn you and you do something pigheaded and stupid anyway, and then you blame us.
Yes Biden fucked up at the debate, but you know whats actually causing him to lose support?
Him fucking up at the debate, in addition to his unconditional support for Netanyahu’s genocide.
Everyone talking and publishing articles about him sounding hoarse and that meaning he has to quit, non stop.
“We finally beat Medicare” isn’t hoarse. Forgetting which question he’s answering isn’t hoarse. Getting in a pissy little slapfight about fucking GOLF isn’t hoarse.
You just want everyone to your left to shut up and be happy. And maybe vote, as a tertiary priority.
Biden seemed old. Trump seems old literally every week.
Biden IS old. Not hoarse, not suffering from a cold, not hit with an energy weapon, not overprepared, not jet lagged, not any of the other ridiculous excuses that the “you don’t know how anything works now shut up” crowd insults everyone within earshot by expecting them to buy. The sun wasn’t in his eyes. The dog didn’t eat his homework.
Trump seems old literally every week.
He sure fucking does. And we need someone who can beat him. Biden is no longer that candidate. His debate performance wasn’t a fluke and there’s no way in hell you don’t know it.
No I’m not I’m just so tired of it being only one way that we pretend the complaints and warnings are the problem.
I didn’t say that at all and you keep lashing out at the people that also don’t want to live in fascism.
No, you are just running an argument that was created by the right’s agenda.
So are you actually an agent of the right, trying to push that line, or just a moron who fell for that stupid argument?
Oh no. The right has spies everywhere… They’re even inside your own party!!!
You idiots are so paranoid about your bogeyman you feel you can just ignore every criticism because it’s probably some evil person trying to stop you from your perfect idea of reality. It’s not perfect. Grow up.
Did you just call that person and Operation…that is really strange.
Woah that’s really cool.
So much “but trump worst!!” in this thread, oof. Vote for the Biden administration if that’s your only choice, fine. But stop pretending that Biden himself is voteworthy - he’s not, and is hardly capable of functioning normally for 6 hours out of the day at this point. Anyone paying attention for the past year who is engaging in honest good faith, should be able to attest to that.
It would be much better for Biden to step down while there’s still time, if you’re really so terrified of Trump and want to ensure a Republican defeat come November. Those who are pushing for Biden himself to stay in are the real threat to democracy.
Come on Dems, how many times do you have to be taught the lesson of Feinstein and RBG?! For that matter, why are you so insistent on politicians literally working into the grave? It’s a grotesque level of elder abuse, what’s being done to Biden right now. You all should be ashamed.
This happens probably because of ppl who actually decide are mostly old rich ppl.
Great, so make your argument heard two years ago and not a few months before the election.
Otherwise, your arguments/debate is just supporting the no vote agenda that is being astro turfed by the right. Which means you are probably a subversive.
We’ve been saying this shit since 2020. Those complaints just haven’t really been acknowledged by democrats until recently when they started running out of ways to plausibly deny it. They quelled it in 2020 by implying he would be only a 1 term president and, using the same existential threats as they’re relying on now, they barely eeked out a win that mostly came down to historic voter turn out.
Now, 4 years later, him being 800 years old is just the cherry on top. After a strategy that seems to have been just keeping him out of the spotlight, he and his PR team have been completely unable to effectively communicate what his administration has actually accomplished, and lets not forget about Palestine; it hasn’t even been a year since all hell broke loose on that issue and Biden’s handling of it has been wishy-washy at best, but whatever it doesn’t matter because the other guy is worse and uh-oh, we didn’t have a real primary to decide if there’s someone better out there. Too bad! Don’t care, didn’t ask.
Enough with this astroturfing shit, this is all plain to see for anyone paying attention. Biden staying in the race is actively hurting the chances of a democrat win, AND democrats down-ballot, and it’s nobody’s fault but the people that insist on him running against all possible voter indications that they won’t vote for him, just as it was with Hilary in 2016. They expected everything to fix itself and everyone to fall in line just like in 2020 because Trump is worse and now they’re shitting themselves because after their loss in 2016 and not nearly as much energy now as in 2020, they (or their donors) are starting to realize that voters might not be bluffing.
I say keep shitting on Biden, because it’s the only thing that seems to be getting democrats to slowly realize that unless they offer someone to voters that can win on their own merits against a competent opponent, they could actually lose to Trump. Again. Fucking embarrassing.
I took me a while to come back and find this reply.
I want to say that I am glad that there were people like you that stuck to your guns. I have hope again.
I was wrong and I am really glad that I was.
Cheers to you.
(Now I have a bunch of other people I need to find and say the same thing to.)
We’ve been making this argument for the last 3+ years, my dude.
No one who is saying all of this now was silent the last few years. I’ve personally been donating to, campaigning for, and bolstering the messaging of non-Mainstream-Dem candidates since I became disillusioned with Obama in my mid 20s. It’s not our fault y’all have been fucking ignoring us.
I took me a while to come back and find this reply.
I want to say that I am glad that there were people like you that stuck to your guns. I have hope again.
I was wrong and I am really glad that I was.
Cheers to you.
(Now I have a bunch of other people I need to find and say the same thing to.)
It’s like they completely ignore the fact that they have been completely ignoring us for 4 years and it’s just everyone else that’s wrong and if they shout a little louder everyone else will just finally do what they say.
It won’t work. They are the kind of people who got in the way of civil rights and left movements in fascist countries all over the world.
They won’t even be able to comprehend how they caused their own pain and go down blaming others that they never had a chance to control anyways.
I took me a while to come back and find this reply.
I want to say that I am glad that there were people like you that stuck to your guns. I have hope again.
I was wrong and I am really glad that I was.
Cheers to you.
(Now I have a bunch of other people I need to find and say the same thing to.)
Yeah I’m glad we didn’t shut up. But also that it worked.
And thanks for coming back.
Yeah, about that…as others pointed out, this sentiment isn’t new, it’s just finally breaking through to establishment dems and those in the corporate media because it’s become impossible to deny any longer.
Personally, I’ve maintained that Biden isn’t well qualified since he got picked as Obama’s VP to appeal to closeted racists. I certainly campaigned hard against him in 2020 when he crawled out of his cave to steal the nomination from Bernie for the 2nd election in a row, for many reasons which happened to include risks from his extremely advanced age and ailing mental faculties. And now here we are, undeniable for all to see, when it actually matters and we need a strong candidate to defeat a fascist uprising in the US we have Biden, one of the only Dem contenders capable of losing to Trump.
Here is something for you to consider - a candidate, especially an incumbent, should be able to earn votes by exhibiting a strong and successful record of leadership accomplishments and capabilities. They don’t deserve votes by virtue of party membership - they have to earn it. Perhaps those who choose not to vote simply haven’t been convinced Biden deserves it. You don’t get to blame and shame voters in this situation. The only one deserving of blame here is Biden himself, for putting his ego above the best interests of the nation.
I took me a while to come back and find this reply.
I want to say that I am glad that there were people like you that stuck to your guns. I have hope again.
I was wrong and I am really glad that I was.
Cheers to you.
(Now I have a bunch of other people I need to find and say the same thing to.)
Hey, thanks for taking the time to return here with this response. Massive respect to you for doing so. I trust we’re both enjoying the fresh wave of momentum resulting from the turn of events, and am excited to join you on Nov 5 to vote =] cheers!
I don’t get to see Biden for 6hrs out of the day like you seem to…I don’t care who runs. I’ll vote against P2025…run who you want, the DNC are knobs, but they make the call that our stupid FPTP system allows.
Yes, as I said vote for the admin if you must, which seems to be the choice forced upon us.
As for Biden, one of the excuses his own team trodded out for his demonstrably ailing performance is that he is only “on” between the hours of 10-4 each day. That is unacceptable for POTUS.
If your doc said he was going to replace himself with a no name mid surgery you’d be ok with that?!?!?!?
Lmfao.
Right, because everyone knows a surgeon’s competency is 1-1 correlated with their notoriety
Any surgeon I do not know by-name is one that cannot be trusted, so the one and only surgeon I know will be performing my surgery regardless of if he’s piss-drunk and coked out.
Never-mind my surgeon introducing me to a new surgeon he recommends; nope, fuck off - he will perform my surgery or we will both die.
Yes lmao
I’m not American and have only brief idea of how US elections work, but… damn this gets more and more ridiculous every day. I’m not saying Trump is better or anything, that dude is batshit crazy egomaniac, but… But… you’re saying there are no other options like if there was only one available candidate from the whole blue party? Or is it impossible (or too late) to switch candidate now? I’m confused.
Biden can resign and hand it over to anyone else. He’s decided he wants to stay in the race even though he clearly has some neurological issues.
Is it him who has to hand it over? Or is it possible for blue party to say “Hey, Joe, enough is enough” and substitute him for “health reasons”?
Both can happen. The party loyalists didn’t want to go against him for their own political careers. The GOP and Dems will push you out if you go against them.
A better comparison would be if the old doctor wouldn’t perform the surgery himself, but a team of highly skilled, younger doctors.
The alternative is an 80-year-old moron saying he plans to kill you a little.
Fuck this OP.
The Democrats are digging their own electoral grave. It’s okay to preach about voting Biden on Lemmy, but it won’t count for anything when masses of real world voters decline to vote for him on account of the constant self-harming of the dems.
A half decent candidate would tank Trump.
A half decent candidate would tank Trump.
I heard this excuse in 2016 with Hilary.
Hilary sucked. she just expected to win, like it was her turn. fuck that, bring something to the table instead of just a name. trump won because it was a show for him and idiots ate it up. Hilary played her “better than thou” card and got wrecked.
Ok, Trumptard. Guaranteed you didn’t listen to a single thing Clinton said in the entire campaign and just listened to “ME TRUMP BEST NUMBER ONE VOTE ME” and you’re now cosplaying as a “Trump followers are idiots” person.
nah, Hilary was pretty shit candidate. trump was worse, a much shittier person over all, but I’m only one vote. she lost what should have been a free pass with her shit attitude and looking down on everyone.
but I appreciate your input! 🙂
Trump was and is a worse person. Clinton was a worse candidate.
Hillary didn’t rise to that level.
Too late to change the system now if you play the voting game. Elect Biden and the rest of the Democrats who will NOT turn the USA into a fascist state in the next four years, THEN start enacting real change to put a genuine Left candidate in that will actually push this country forward when they’re elected in four years.
If you want to play the voting game, that’s how you play. The only other alternative is revolution and enable the “alter or abolish” option right the fuck now.
Make your choice of those two things. The “lol, I won’t vote” or “gonna vote Trump anyway” “option” is just alt-right Trumpery disguised as being concerned about a second Biden presidency for any reason.
You are the kind of Northern racists that MLK Jr dealt with that would say “time will fix this” and that those looking for equality needed to just quiet down and not be a bother.
Now, is always better than later. Change must happen even if you feel it inconveniences you and that order is more important than justice. You have no idea what the future holds but we have now.
Some of us are trying to seize a moment to actually make this country worth living in. And it doesn’t involve voting for Trump like your brand of idiots think is the only option. If you are so comfortable that it doesn’t matter to you then get out of the way.
I’m out of the loop. What the hell is he talking about?
It’s honestly shocking how that wasn’t an absolutely bigger deal because it’s a freaking terrifying thing to say from the person we are all saying has to win or else.
But for him it’s just another paycheck.
I think it’s honestly why the front page is flooded with the project 2025 stuff to kinda bury how terrible a candidate Biden is becoming.
Trump is worse. Nuff said.
And Putin is a monster, Hitler was an incel asshole, Boris Johnson was a purposeful buffoon. The opponent being someone you don’t like doesn’t mean they don’t win and you can ignore everyone else’s opinion.
How about a criminal grifter doctor that says he doesn’t care about you, he just wants your money?
He tries to sell you beans while you’re on the operating table.
Let’s be fucking real here. The party head figures will be running the white house if biden gets in.
Still better than Trump, anything is better than Trump.
Is that ok? No. Is this a “you you want one bullet in the head or two bullets?” Yeah, pretty much though the the two bullets will first shoot you in the balls for fun. Chose one bullet, please
That wouldnt be so bad, but people vote for brands, not policy or administration
Yeah, I will at least know what to expect, and not have to worry about them speeding running the creation of a fascistic theocracy.
Look I’m from Missouri, I will vote for a dead guy again if I have to. Because the other choice is fascism.
Was it a facist play when the DNC propped up Biden and forced in Kamala even though the base was behind Bernie and Kamala was so bad the she was forced to drop out early in the primaries? How come no one talks about that being facist?
If the dead guy is going to lose and you can pick a live candidate thst supports your platform that will win, will you still run the dead guy and lose?
I’m still willing to hear a viable candidate and how that would work less than half a year before an election. In order for us to have another nominee we have to do something to get someone else to put their name on a ticket. That actions might create a bit of a loophole where any party could run a lame duck candidate in the primary, won, and go on to basically pull that candidate for “cognitive decline”.
What I believe will happen, based on our laws and our history, is w.ell have another Al Gore moment where the vote gets split and we get a Republican as a result. And since right now the Republican is Donald “I touch 13 year Olds” Trump, I’m gonna ask you why a sane person would choose to let Trump become president.
and how that would work less than half a year before an election.
Normal countries don’t have elections that last over half a year. It’s clearly workable everywhere else, and it’s not like the people already voting Biden are going to not vote for whoever the Dem candidate is.
I don’t buy that it would cause confusion or somehow be less viable to change candidates; this isn’t 1880, we have phones and TVs and the internet now. If the candidate changed as little as a month before the election everyone would still know what was going on, even if was a huge pain in the ass to account for in terms of ballots.
"Normal countries don’t have"I’m gonna stop you right there. Because what I am asking is how it works for this election at this time with our constitution, laws, and regulations. Because that is what is pertinent now in the event that he steps down.
As for the bit about them voting for any democrat on the ticket (we know historically that’s not what happens), this is literally what happened with Hilary Clinton. It caused so few people who otherwise might have voted not to vote that we got Donald Trump as president for a first term. It’s not about confusion. It’s about people being disheartened enough to think it doesn’t matter. And believing in the super majority of democrats who will vote so they don’t have to. Because not voting is a form of protest.
People would still know. But the whole reason the media is playing up the age and health of the president currently is to convince people not to vote. And it’s working. There are people in this country who voted for Trump in protest because Bernie Sanders was not ok the ticket.
Because what I am asking is how it works for this election at this time with our constitution, laws, and regulations.
The convention hasn’t even happened! Biden isn’t even officially the candidate yet!
I’m sorry but who the fuck is going to not vote or vote for Trump because Biden isn’t the candidate? Nobody loves the dude.
I’m sorry but who the fuck is going to not vote or vote for Trump because Biden isn’t the candidate?
I’m starting to think the answer is “every centrist on lemmy.”
Why ask him to step down if they can choose someone else. He is the official candidate as voted for in the primary. The primary is over. And if you’re gonna stick your head in the sand and believe that people are going to just vote for whoever they happen to put up as a democrat I’m gonna need you to look back on the 2016 election like I said because we already know this has happened before. If you think it can’t happen again you’re part of the problem.
He is the official candidate as voted for in the primary.
Cool, he’s still not the official candidate because he hasn’t been selected at the convention yet. If you’re going to lecture someone for not knowing how the system works you should at least understand that the primaries don’t actually select the candidate, the convention does.
“We have to run a weak candidate that polls like shit because the last time we did this exact same thing we lost but it’ll work this time” is the real head in the sand stance.
