I like the idea of nobody smoking, but any policy like this probably needs to be coupled with some kind of enforcement. Half or more of cigarette sales are already illegal:
Illegal cigarette sales could comprise up to 67 per cent of Ontario’s total tobacco market, 45 per cent in B.C. and 44 per cent in Newfoundland.
I like the idea too, but prohibition has never been successful at anything other than creating black markets
This kind of law cannot be tolerated. Not even if the goal is admirable.
‘Legal for you, forever’ but ‘forever illegal for your children’ is blatantly not the same thing as ‘you must be eighteen.’ It’s inequality. It’s generational discrimination. It is a separate set of laws, based on the circumstances of your birth, without any fig-leaf for safety, ability, or intellect.
Grandfathering and phasing things out are common
“Grandfathering” is named after overtly racist voter suppression.
‘But we do that already’ is exactly why this cannot be tolerated. It’s a pleasant-sounding excuse for new forms of exclusion. We cannot tolerate this kind of law.
You wanna phase things out? Phase it out for everybody, equally.
It’s generational discrimination
You mean, like between the people who lived and died without being able to smoke cannabis legally and those who now can?
Every single law ever approved has created a barrier between those who lived before the law was approved and those who lived after. Public health care, public pensions, everything.
Congratulations, you found the worst take.
Different laws now versus then are not the same thing as different laws for me versus you. I do not feel the need to explain this. If you exist in some four-dimensional paradox where time and space are interchangeable, warp yourself to a future where you understand how change works.
Disappointed in every single person who thinks frostbiker’s comment isn’t objectively wrong.
Didn’t they just repeal something like that in New Zealand?
Yes. New Zealand is infected by conservatives again, and the only alternative to re-opening sales of cigarettes to children to get more tax money was to tax the rich people at all. And that will not do.
Yes, I think even down to the year.
Shit policy idea. Banning things never works. Please see all of history as evidence.
Increase taxes on nicotine ten-fold if it’s so important. Use taxes in part to ensure that the amount of smokes that fall off the back of trucks doesn’t spike. That’s about as good as you’re gonna get to influence anyone who’s addicted.
This kind of policy is not about influencing people who are already addicted, it is about trying to prevent anyone new from getting addicted and eventually putting the entire thing in the rear view.
Which “all of history” are you using as a base? Because this is a slow phase-out of cigarettes, nothing like anything we’ve had before.
This is not a ban on nicotine, like we had bans on alcohol. People would still be able to vape nicotine.
You don’t have to increase it 10 fold, that just creates an overnight black market.
Banning sales to people born after a specific date is just as good a solution as any. If you want go full retar-, er, libertarian on it, let people grow their own, but forbid sales/distribution.
There is no upside to cigarettes – it’s the leading cause of lung cancer and a dozen other diseases that cost our health care system billions in each province, every year. The only people who will complain will be the companies who make billions in profit from human addiction, misery, and death.
Maybe nicotine addiction should be medicalized.
Anyone born after [date] could get it legally through a pharmacy after talking to their doctor/nurse-practitioner and explaining why they need a prescription (ie they are addicted and can’t function without it).
I actually like that framing. I’m imagining explaining it to my 5 year old:
What’s that person doing?
They took the wrong medicine and now they have to take that medicine everyday. It’s yucky, expensive, and very hard on their body.
Why did they take the wrong medicine?
They didn’t realize it was medicine and they thought it looked interesting or fun, I’m not sure exactly. You know not to take medicine without talking to mum, dad, or a doctor right?
Yeah sure let’s go back to banning drugs.
This is a ban on cigarettes, not on nicotine
Good point I didn’t think of. I guess removing that convenience could discourage a lot of people. But won’t it still increase contraband?
Unlikely because the cigarettes can still enter the market and me commercialized legally, so the economics of contraband doesn’t change. It’s like the currently existing age restrictions already in place.
We might observe some just not caring to check birthdates, like currently not every cashier asks for IDs selling alcohol as they should. But the benefit is still there if a decent percentage of the next generation will just trade cigarettes for vapes for the sake of convenience.
Yeah, let’s bring back lead in gas. And asbestos. And raising radiation exposure limits. And measles. Smallpox. In fact, let’s roll back all progress we’ve ever made to improve human health. Let’s get those 10 year olds back into the coal mines and smoking unfiltered cigarettes.
Yeah, let’s bring back […] measles. Smallpox
You heard what America’s aristocracy was making its dumbest do during CoVid, right?
Actually, filtered cigarettes have been said to be worse in some articles I’ve seen.
As you said above though, unadulterated natural tobacco should always be available to people who have a cultural connection with it and can prepare it traditionally. Take away the cool factor and the chemical-laden stuff could hopefully be phased out. Education campaigns can also talk about the human suffering and environmental costs of production on a large scale.
filtered cigarettes have been said to be worse
Yeah. They add fiberglass to the inhaled particulate and are easily defeated as a filter as the act of smoking crushes and chanellizes the filter.
They should ban smoking cannabis, too. It’s just as bad. Produces tar in the lungs and can cause lung, throat and mouth cancer as well. And because it dilates the bronches, it goes in deeper.
Honestly if they do that people will fall back to contraband. And that’s worse.
And I love having the occasional cigar. (Like a couple of times a year) There’s very little harm in that.
Cannabis has potential medical applications in areas like pain management. Tobacco has none that I’m aware of—its only legitimate use is in the ceremonies of some Indigenous peoples.
So, given that one is useful and the other useless, why do you want us to get rid of the useful one?
Nicotine outside of its addictiveness does have perks. It does assist with anxiety and makes you more aware which is said to make you remember things better. They aren’t advertised often because the downsides of smoking cigarettes outweigh them usually.
I would argue that if they were trying to make it about health, edibles and such may reduce lung and other impacts by cannabis but only time will tell in studies.
The law just seems strange to me to say, we vote ban smoking cigarettes (pre-rolled) for those who can’t vote and have no say, but we keep that privilege for ourselves. Also no changes to rules about smoking around those people.
Either make the rules for everyone or no one.
Yes. I’m a frequent user. But I don’t smoke it. I use oils or edibles. There are other ways to consume cannabis than by smoking it.
I don’t care if people down vote me for this. Smoking anything has big potential cancer risks and that’s a fact.
