I recently made an account on Beehaw because I’ve been having pleasant interactions with the instance from my lemm.ee account. Some good threads, seemed like a progressive space. So I went back to the philosophy documents and read them again, liked most of what I saw (again) and signed up for an account today. Decided to break in my new account by browsing the top posts of the last month. Several of them were threads I recognised and had commented in, and felt like revisiting. Except my comments weren’t there. When I got to a comment I very specifically remember replying to (someone asked what’s up with HBomber and James Somerton), and couldn’t find my comment, I decided to check the modlog.

I’m banned. I’ve been talking into an empty void for 4 months. I was banned for being in bad faith. And one of my comments was removed by an admin, because I told people to assume good faith and apparently that’s not nice.

This doesn’t align at all with the documents I’ve been reading today. The ones about assuming good faith, and about giving people chances to clarify, and about how banning is a last resort only for obvious trolls. When I came to this community 4 months ago to make a post about fediverse drama, I wasn’t interested in active participation in the community, and I didn’t make that post with that in mind. I understand how that might not fit the desires of the community here. But I didn’t make that post in bad faith. I, and whoever wrote those pages on the philosophy of Beehaw, wanted the same thing back then. To create a corner of the internet free of hate speech and full of kindness. Now? I’m jaded and beaten. I don’t want to create a kind community anymore, I want to find one. I’ve given up on that ambition. So that’s why I reread the updated documents with hope. Why I created an account. And why I want to know whether beehaw.org is actually the website I read about in those documents. Because those modlogs say the opposite of what those documents said. If I don’t fit in here, if the ideals I thought I saw aren’t present, I’d like to find out quickly.

Should I still hope?

  • DroneRights@beehaw.orgOPEnglish
    0·
    9 months ago

    But just because I feel frustrated that someone does not see things exactly the same way I do, does not mean that I can automatically assume that they’re wrong and evil and it’s okay to be mean to them.

    Why would you think that I see evil in anyone else when you know that I don’t like using intents in discussions? That’s a contradiction.

    This is what I’m talking about. You’re using intents and you think I think you’re evil. But it doesn’t make sense given the very conversation we’re having. I don’t think you know how to have a conversation without assuming you know everyone else’s perception of everyone else’s intents.

    Using your empathy to deduce the conclusions of someone else’s cognitive empathy is an advanced technique. You’re going straight to the most complicated thing empathy is capable of, and you’re making mistakes. You need to slow down. I’m difficult to empathise with, so you need to stop pushing yourself to use the most advanced techniques on me, you need to be patient and use some simpler techniques, and you need to learn how to have a conversation without relying on your empathy as a crutch.

    I know you discussed a lot of other points in your comment, but I’m not going to talk about them right now. Because you and I both agree that I’ve been going too fast for you. We both need to take our time and make sure you understand what I’m saying in its entirety, and that means not getting distracted. We’re going to slowly discuss the empathy issue until you fully understand what I’m talking about. And I have a lot more to say on the empathy topic, but first I need to understand that you understand that I’m saying you need to slow down. You’re trying to use too much empathy and it’s not working. Your empathy is telling you untrue things about me, because you’re expecting it to perform miracles for you.

    • Chris Remington@beehaw.org
      0·
      9 months ago

      …most people don’t have their fingers on the web of cause and effect like I do.

      You need to slow down.

      …you need to stop pushing yourself…

      …you need to be patient…

      …you need to learn how to have a conversation without relying on your empathy as a crutch.

      …Your empathy is telling you untrue things about me, because you’re expecting it to perform miracles for you.

      These statements are very pompous and NOT nice.

      Consider this a very strong warning.

      • DroneRights@beehaw.orgOPEnglish
        0·
        9 months ago

        Axolotling misunderstood me because they made a mistake. There’s nothing wrong with making mistakes, they don’t make you any worse as a person. Everyone makes mistakes. Sometimes mistakes can lead to hurt feelings, but knowing about them is necessary to solve problems. Axolotling told me that they were having trouble understanding me because I didn’t explain things fully, and they asked me to be more thorough in my explanations.

        Do you think nice behaviour is helping people who ask for help in the way they ask for help, changing my behaviour when they ask me to, and being honest and gentle with them about how they can accomplish the goals they want to accomplish? Or do you think nice behaviour is ignoring people who ask for help, refusing to change my behaviour when others ask me to change it, and ignoring problems that other people want solved?

        I will follow the rules either way. If you tell me not to tell people they’ve made mistakes, I’ll listen to you. If someone asks for help understanding me again, I’ll explain to them why I can’t help, provided I have your agreement that this is what you want me to do.