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Well, this is a fun discussion!
…Anyways, I like to think that the title implies you’re supposed to vote more than once lol
It also implies that not voting for Trump somehow counts more than voting for Trump does
The article is actually about how people that have voted more consistently will vote for Biden and people that vote more inconsistently will vote for Trump.
Very different from how I interpreted the headline.
Ok then! One vote for Trump is better than multiple not-votes for no one, so I’ll vote for Trump!
/s
I had difficulty parsing the article title. I thought it meant that not voting means you back trump (since this is a common narrative by democrat supporters), but actually it’s saying that people who vote less consistently support trump more.
Wow, this article sure did get the bot trash buzzing lol.
Vote like your (or someone you love’s) life depends on it and convince everyone you know to do the same, because it does.
I am really not following all the vitriol in the comments, are people not only ignoring the article to react to the headline but then also mis-reading the headline?
It’s not saying anyone ought to vote a certain way, it’s just pointing out that low-propensity voters tend to support Trump.
I suspect this is due to the recent polarization around education. Highly educated people tend to vote more, and over the last decade they have tended to vote more and more for Democrats. And vice versa for low-formal-education folks.
Yeah, when I read the headline I figured it was saying that if you don’t vote, that means you’re actively supporting trump. But after reading the article, it’s definitely not saying that as far as I can tell.
I chalk it up to the headline being worded weirdly, and just the fact that people have been saying things sorta like that.
This ain’t no big revelation to anyone. Since the 1960’s Republicans have relied on liberal voter’s apathy to win seats in government. It’s liberalism’s greatest weakness and failure - the belief that someone else should be responsible because they can’t be bothered.
Since the 1960’s Republicans have relied on liberal voter’s apathy to win seats
Makes you wonder why Democrats continue to foster that apathy.
A controlled opposition
how?
For example when Obama had the power to codify Roe v. Wade he didn’t.
What if your a lifelong red voter and you vote less?
Like I get where your coming from, but it’s only because your audience are the sane ones.
Wouldn’t that mean the opposite then? Voters more likely to vote will vote Biden, so if the less likely to vote don’t vote that gives Vixen an edge?
I want to repeat this as much as possible because I think it’s incredibly important. When you vote for a president, you are not voting for one person, you are voting for thousands. You are voting for an entire branch of government, possibly 2. The president appoints an insane amount of positions, so when you vote for the one person you need to also think about all the other positions they will be nominating people for. Hundreds of federal judges, hundreds of secretaries, dozens of heads of departments and agencies, hundreds of ambassadors, and most importantly, potentially lifetime appointments of Supreme court judges, which can flip an entire other branch of government. There are also tons of lower level positions on top of those, and if that’s not enough already, many of these appointments span multiple presidencies, so you’re not just voting for the next 4 years, but potentially long after that.
So when you’re looking at the ballot, do not think about the names on the paper, think about the thousands of incredibly important, powerful, and influential roles that they will fill. As powerful as the president is, when you add up all those other positions, they are even more important than the one position of president.
And if you want to know why we haven’t made much forward progress, well… we flip parties every 8 years.
If you want to know why we’re backsliding, it’s because when Republicans have an advantage it’s 58/42 and when Democrats have an advantage it’s 51/50 for two weeks.
Over the past 50 years Republicans have had more political power in this country.
Democrats held a comfortable dual majority during four years Obama’s presidency and aside from the ACA did fuck all with it. And that’s just in recent history. Go back a bit farther and they had 8 straight years. Go back a bit farther and Democrats had comfortable dual majorities for 26 years straight.
Your own link disproves your point and makes mine. Yeah, there were times with House and Senate Democrat majorities, usually with a Republican president.
Republicans have had more control.over the direction of this country than Democrats for the past fifty years.
You could also make the thin line for president larger, which would make it more obvious.
My fucking god what is it going to take for you fucking zealots to wake the fuck up and get angry at rich politicians fucking us over regardless of party? Fucking wake up. What the fuck.
Fuck the Democrats. Fuck the Republicans. Fuck this procorporate trash.
Where are you from?
Zealot? Well, fuck you too, buddy.
Serinus made a great point. Republicans have had their hands on the levers of power because shitheads want to see liberals suffer, and OTHER shitheads scream bloody murder because they didn’t get the rainbow alicorn they swore they were promised. Cluebus for ya, pal. More than ultra-leftie liberals get to call the shot in the USA and you taking your fucking ball and going home hurts all of us…
didn’t get the rainbow alicorn they swore they were promised.
Nobody promised us a rainbow alicorn. But they did make promises and they were broken. We are not morally obligated to accept that kind of treatment.
you taking your fucking ball and going home hurts all of us…
Oh buddy. We’re taking more than the ball. We’re taking our lives.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68782177
Go fuck yourself.
If you have thoughts of suicide, do what the article says to do and talk to someone. If things are so bad that you’re contemplating killing yourself, this is a dangerous position to be, and I wouldn’t wish that on anyone, even a Trumper or a useful idiot. But throwing that link about suicide down won’t change my point.
You don’t always get exactly what you want from a politician. Ask the Kiwis. They recently stayed home, DESPITE their country offering multiple Left-Wing parties and a system that ensures their vote for one of those Left-Wing parties won’t result in one of the Right-Wing Parties being elected, and now, National, ACT, and NZ First (their Conservative parties, going from main-stream to whacko-extreme) are calling the shots and have rolled back EVERY left-wing priority they could get their hands on at a rapid pace. This is what you get when you say ‘not liberal enough’ and stay home, and that’s BEFORE FPTP used here in the USA gets in on the game.
Again. One of two things will happen in January.
- Biden will start his second term, doing much the same as he’s done in the first term, SLOOOWLY and ever so painfully eeking out some Liberal priority or another, and then being shut down by the Right-Wing Court.
- Trump will start his second term, and you’ll be fighting to not be disappeared into the back of some white van by literal secret police while Trump’s goons enact Project 2025 to ‘erase woke everywhere’.
Every vote Biden doesn’t get…is an increase of the chance that everything you supposedly stand for BEYOND Israel being undone while you dodge shitheads with white vans like Floyd Protesters did in Seattle. I’m just going to be here to remind you and everyone else who reads this of that truth.
And fuck yourself back to you, pal.
I tried to vote, but the DNC cancelled the Democratic primary in my state.
I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted. This is accurate. They did not once your vote.
I’m getting downvoted because it’s accurate.
I actually agree with OP that everyone should be voting Biden in the general, but this constant messaging is tone-deaf as Hillary Clinton and is going to be self defeating.
You have another vote coming up.
In any case, no they didn’t. The Democratic National Convention didn’t cancel any state primaries. Your state party did. Your local Democrats decided to not have a primary.
That’s not how it happened. Yeah, sure, it’s technically up to the state party, but it was at the request of the DNC. There is authority, and then there is soft power.
Getting to pick between two candidates chosen for me by oligarchs doesn’t seem like Democracy to me.
And now we’re into conspiracy theory territory.
That’s usually a clue that you’re wrong about something.
Public information bro. Conspiracies actually do happen BTW. We have a former president being charged with involvement in several of you haven’t been keeping up with the news
They do happen but they’re rare. That’s why they’re in the news.
Generally speaking, you should think “maybe I’m wrong” before you think “there’s a conspiracy”.
“National party exerts pressure on state party” is hardly a great plot for an X-files episode. And that’s assuming it took more than a polite phone call
It would honestly be harder to believe that a state party would exclude someone from the ballot without at least discussing it with the national party.
Still their decision. And the reasoning for their decision was not arbitrary. Some no-name candidate didn’t qualify in time. That’s not a conspiracy.
votes third party
Ironically, in that episode, voting third party was best because both candidates were monsters.
Today one is a monster and the other is the not a monster but still mostly represents monsters, but some people too.
Don’t blame me, I voted for Kodos!
I took some time to look at who the 2020 Biden voter are who are considering not voting for him.
While there are a growing number of such groups, one of the biggest is Muslims. They get that Trump is a racist and hates Muslims. They’re also currently watching Biden going out of his way to support Israel in their genocide. To them, Biden doesn’t just represent monsters, he is a monster. They’re logic is essentially, “We’re fucked either way. Let’s get rid of the monster in front of us and then we’ll worry about the next monster.”
It doesn’t matter if you or I agree with that. They’re not asking for permission to feel that way. If the Democratic leadership doesn’t address those concerns with significantly more empathy than, “don’t be stupid”, the likely outcome is that Biden will miss out on many of those votes.
Unfortunately Biden has been racking up voter groups that feel betrayed by him. My preference would have been for Biden to find some other Democratic candidate, retire gracefully and strongly back the new candidate.
It doesn’t matter if you or I agree with that.
I’d argue it matters a lot.
What’s the argument that it does?
Do you think that this disagreement is likely to change anyone’s mind?
Take a fairly famous example. Bassem Youssef has very publicly embraced the sentiment I’m describing. How does your agreement or disagreement have any impact at all?
I’d argue that it will only have an impact if you choose an action that’s likely to induce change. He very clearly says that he considers the threats that “If you don’t vote for Biden you’re voting for Trump,” messages to be a form of blackmail.
He finds it unconvincing so it fails to work on him. As near as I can tell, his attitude is fairly representative of a significant number of voters.
How does your agreement or disagreement have any impact at all?
This is a democracy. Potential voters are being influenced right now by the discussions we’re having.
I should clarify then.
There is currently some percentage of people who plan to vote for Biden, some that plan to vote for Trump and some who are undecided.
Most polling shows that, if there was an election today, Biden would lose pretty badly.
If you simply agree or disagree, is that likely to change anyone’s planned voting behavior? If you continue to insult the people who do not currently plan to vote for Biden, do you think that will change their minds?
He even said during 2020 that he wanted to be a one term president, that he was only there to beat trump.
I guess you can argue he still needs to beat trump.
He even said during 2020 that he wanted to be a one term president
He literally never said that. This is pure propaganda.
“If Biden is elected, he’s going to be 82 years old in four years and he won’t be running for reelection,” a prominent adviser to the campaign told Politico.
I guess the words didn’t come from his mouth in particular but when your a politician, your staff are your representatives, and his said it.
Can’t believe people would call our verifiable facts as propaganda so confidently with nothing to back it up…
Like I said,
He literally never said that
One fucking advisor to the campaign said it. Not even his official staff. An advisor.
“Verifiable facts”, my ass. It’s propaganda and you just repeated it without ever looking into it.
I’m all for someone trying to beat Trump.
It’s looking less and less like Biden will be able to pull that off.
From what i recall, he was undecided. The media and others were projecting and suggesting that he should be a 1-term president. —Honestly, his vagueness about policy and his advocacy for nothing but the status-quo are primarily what led me to vote Green for the last presidential election.
How does this make any sense in the context of the article?
It doesn’t. They didn’t read it.
That’s just voting for Trump with extra steps.
Nope. And either way these posts are really good at making protest voters
Nah, anyone who protest votes is doing it because they’re an immature asshole. We can convert some people on the fringe to sense but a lot of people can’t handle the fact that it’s imperative that they put their name next to the less bad of two people.
Just to remind you, Trump will institute a national abortion ban - voting for Biden will directly save hundreds of women’s lives… it’s the absolute easiest action to avert unnecessary deaths you’ll ever have in your lifetime.
If you can’t do this, you can’t do fucking anything.
All these posts blaming protest voters and those who don’t vote are all generated because of the bad numbers from the primaries right? And the over all loss in confidence in Biden due to his willful protection of isreal right?
Just got to remind people that they don’t really have a choice when the real voting happens. I think if you wanted to reach these voters these posts would be more detrimental then helpful.
What would help is if Biden stopped doing the hated things.
Or is this just a circle jerk reddit thing?
I think I was pretty fucking clear. I’m posting because it will save lives. Imagine how difficult it is to pull someone from a burning car, now imagine how difficult it would be to fill in the bubble next to Biden on a ballot - both actions will save lives.
So why is it so fucking difficult to fill in that bubble?
I don’t know the inverse to that is also true. Joe Biden could throw progressive some more bones if it meant saving women’s lives.
It’s bizarre to me that the onus is on us and not the candidate running for office to convince us.
All those lives in Gaza saved.
Donald said “Israel should finish the job.” IDK how much more directly one can reference “Final Solution.” Sure, he will save the Palestinians.
It fucking sucks and I strongly support the uncommitted movement and putting all the pressure we can on him about Gaza (see my post history if you want). Trump is going to be as bad or worse on Gaza, it fucking sucks but there isn’t a way you can vote to fix Gaza.
And you somehow think voting for Trump, or giving him an advantage, will help in Gaza?
He will put zero pressure on Netanyahu. He’ll likely openly support the effort and say something like “the Palestinians are just like the illegals crossing our border.”
Voting isn’t picking someone you like, voting is choosing the person with the best chance of winning and creating policies aligned with your values and ideals. If you vote for somebody with zero chance of winning, you’re giving an advantage to the candidate who undermines your values being implemented in the long term.
If we had ranked choice voting, or if the alternative candidate wasn’t openly threatening democracy, the rationale would be very different.
The smart people tried to explain to the voters that Brexit would be an enormous failure, but the voters let their emotions get in the way of being rational, and now they’re suffering and wished they had voted differently.
We have the potential for something much worse with Trump. Much worse. If you can’t see through your emotions to understand that if Trump is elected your vote may never matter again, I’m not sure you have the rationale capacity to be worth the time I spent typing this response.
No you are not. This isn’t some revelation. That people just didn’t know that fracturing the Democratic parties vote hurts their chances against the republicans. You are making this post for selfish reasons.
Like i said, demonizing people who find it hard to vote for someone protecting a genocide is for your own self gratification. Its not to change minds, its not to help Biden beat trump. Its solely to start a circle jerk to validate your decision to vote blue no matter who, and to quiet that little voice about how bad of a candidate he is
You are doing no one any favors
The idea isn’t to convert you. The idea is to help others see your arguments for what they are and not fall down the same nihilistic trap.
I love how all these people who are suddenly vocal about the terrible situation in Gaza fall short of realizing that getting Trump in office would be catastrophically worse. With that logic, the only practical option is to vote for Biden in the general. A 3rd party vote is just throwing your vote away.
The only conclusion I see here is these people are either disinformation agents, naive fools, or both.
That’s what they said the last election and voter turnout was nuts.
The blaming of the protest voters shamed them into voting for Biden? Yea i doubt that.
Though right now the situation is different. Biden has done some things that make voters balk. Maybe he should stop doing that. It might help more then making circle jerk posts on Lemmy
This has nothing to do with blame. It’s mathematics. You can either add to the resistance against Trump or not.
You say that like this math factors into any part of why people are protest voting. They know this already and this gives nothing to the conversation. Instead, your best bet is to find out what they want and maybe go over a plan that gets them what they need. Sure as shit attempting to shame people with your basic math will only accomplish in widening the divide and pushing contrariness.
No it isn’t
I believe you if you’re logging in from the multiverse instance where West polls at over 40%, or the one where federal rank choice voting exists.
Do you want ranked choice voting?
I have it in my area for city / county seats. And I voted for it.
You specified federal. Thats available to vote for too you know
Yes. I like ranked choice, I have voted in favor of it in the past, and I would be in support of it for more elections. Including federal elections.
Don’t have to believe me, you already made yourself sound like an idiot with that claim, my vote is for the person I voted for, nobody else.
so does this include the US dissidents not allowed to vote legally?
fuck that
politicians like Biden crafted and wrote laws over the years that culminated in mine and others votes being taken away
not our fault people keep voting Demopublicans in
we need to get rid of both these corporate bought parties
It’s like you’ve never picked up a US history book.
Back before women were allowed the vote, they would still go out and work for candidates.
[Citation Needed]
According to the article:
Source: NORC/University of Pennsylvania Department of Political Science
Does that say that Biden’s support is due to “US dissidents not allowed to vote legally”?
I’m sorry. I thought you were asking for the source of the headline claim. I believe the person you’re responding to was referring to the insurrectionists. Right-wing media tends to label them as dissidents, activists, demonstrators, etc. when they should be described as criminals.
You’re not being oppressed. You post this every single time.
dissidents not allowed to vote legally
Do you mean criminals?
Presuming you’re talking about disenfranchised citizens, that’s mostly felons. And IMO it is abhorrent to take away a citizen’s right to vote unless that citizen committed a specific type of crime against the government (being that it is the representative of the people), like sedition, treason, or insurrection. And even then, disenfranchisement should not be permanent.
But notably people are disenfranchised by their state and city jurisdictions. The federal government does not determine whether you can vote in any given election, just the rules that apply to all elections. If you want to blame a federal body, there’s plenty to go around - SCOTUS has upheld disenfranchisement as constitutional and Congress has not really passed meaningful laws defining and regulating the practice. But I can’t think of a law that Biden has been instrumental in that contributes here, other than, of course, his 1994 crime bill. That’s not a small deal but it is far more complicated than “Biden took away voter rights”
You lost your voting rights… how?
I want to vote more, but when I try to vote more than once the poll workers get upset and tell me to leave.
You should try being a republican.
I’m voting as hard as I can
There’s just no privacy anywhere anymore.
you need to be a republican governor’s son. if you are, you can vote illegally as many times as you like and no one cares.
Alright. RFK Jr. it is then…
Ew.
You’re really gonna stick it to…whoever you wanna stick it to, I guess.
They’re going to stick it to themself.
So, you voted for Trump.
I was fucking lying, idiot.
I’ll vote for Vermin Supreme like always.
@yadownwithcpp think you used your wrong alt to stir shit up. Commie fucking scum. Stay in your troll farm.
easy
The only true candidate for president.
Bro is publicly selling out to the highest bidder while pedaling antisemitism, vaccine denial, and whatever other grift he can. At least choose the right high horse like Cornel West or something jfc
The less you brain, the more you back Trump.
