Exactly. Battletoads isn’t unfair, its just extremely hard (not different from Dark Souls). It’s different kind of hard, compared to Turtles, which had bad controls in example.
There are definitely control issues with like the sticky walls level. Some of the jumping has like completely bullshit edge detection and the rocket riding is way harder than the turbo tunnel, but you never hear anyone complain about it because no one ever makes it there.
Glad you like it. He always does this in-dept technical explanation, which sometimes is too technical for me. I noticed it wasn’t even the video I wanted to link and updated the reply with the additional link about the water level specifically.
I very much disagree on the Dark Souls comparison. It is a large part of why there has increasingly been the distinction between “Nintendo Hard” and “Hard but Fair” with (From) Souls games very much being the latter.
In a From-Souls, every boss short of the later DLCs (and puzzle bosses) have multiple viable paths. You can carry a tower shield or use ranged attacks or whatever.
Whereas, in the god awful speeder sequence especially, there really is one real path and it is to memroize the pattern and enter in the specific sequence.
The closest From-Souls got was Malenia and needing to know how to counter her Water Fowl attack. There was still the way to stagger her to death, but that was very build specific and a LOT of that game has the Dark Souls 2 problem of enemies with way too much poise. Combine that with dodging her dive bomb in phase 2 and she was VERY “sequence-y”. Which is why she got nerfed pretty heavily over the first few patches.
I guess honorable mention to most of the back half Sekiro bosses where people tend to learn how to bait the AI into sequences to exploit. But that is mostly a “failing” on the player. The most egregious example is main path
spoiler
Ishin and that is actually a REALLY bullshit trick by From. You fight him in a field of tall grass. But if you run about twenty meters back, you fight him in an open field and can now see his legs and identify all the attacks and react and punish accordingly.
Exactly. Battletoads isn’t unfair, its just extremely hard (not different from Dark Souls). It’s different kind of hard, compared to Turtles, which had bad controls in example.
There are definitely control issues with like the sticky walls level. Some of the jumping has like completely bullshit edge detection and the rocket riding is way harder than the turbo tunnel, but you never hear anyone complain about it because no one ever makes it there.
Here is a very good technical video about this topic: The Bad Jump Design and 30 FPS Gravity of TMNT (NES) - Behind the Code
Edit: I linked the wrong video. Here is the one I wanted to link, from the same guy:
The Broken Water Level of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (NES) - Behind the Code
This was a great watch. Thanks for posting it!
Glad you like it. He always does this in-dept technical explanation, which sometimes is too technical for me. I noticed it wasn’t even the video I wanted to link and updated the reply with the additional link about the water level specifically.
Wow! What a cool video! And what a cool channel! I’ve watched a few now, thanks for pointing it out!
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
The Bad Jump Design and 30 FPS Gravity of TMNT (NES) - Behind the Code
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I very much disagree on the Dark Souls comparison. It is a large part of why there has increasingly been the distinction between “Nintendo Hard” and “Hard but Fair” with (From) Souls games very much being the latter.
In a From-Souls, every boss short of the later DLCs (and puzzle bosses) have multiple viable paths. You can carry a tower shield or use ranged attacks or whatever.
Whereas, in the god awful speeder sequence especially, there really is one real path and it is to memroize the pattern and enter in the specific sequence.
The closest From-Souls got was Malenia and needing to know how to counter her Water Fowl attack. There was still the way to stagger her to death, but that was very build specific and a LOT of that game has the Dark Souls 2 problem of enemies with way too much poise. Combine that with dodging her dive bomb in phase 2 and she was VERY “sequence-y”. Which is why she got nerfed pretty heavily over the first few patches.
I guess honorable mention to most of the back half Sekiro bosses where people tend to learn how to bait the AI into sequences to exploit. But that is mostly a “failing” on the player. The most egregious example is main path
spoiler
Ishin and that is actually a REALLY bullshit trick by From. You fight him in a field of tall grass. But if you run about twenty meters back, you fight him in an open field and can now see his legs and identify all the attacks and react and punish accordingly.
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