• R_Schuhart@alien.topB
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    10 months ago

    Bayer Leverkusen is seen in Germany as a plastic club by a lot of fans, mostly because they have distanced themselves from their working class roots. They have a family friendly atmosphere and stadium. As a result a part of the ultra fanbase is trying to distance themselves from that clean image by being edgy and coming up with shocking statements.

    They have a cult mascot, “der Zitronenmann”, they use as a “spokesperson to” say controversial shit trying to get attention and stay relevant. They have provoked and picked fights with rivals as well, mainly Bremen and Koln.

    • Nutzer1337@alien.topB
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      10 months ago

      Bayer Leverkusen is seen in Germany as a plastic club by a lot of fans, mostly because they have distanced themselves from their working class roots.

      No, they are seen as bad for the Bundesliga because they undermine 50+1 by being a works team for Bayer.

        • CrazyChopstick@alien.topB
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          10 months ago

          So what? It’s still a special exemption from the law, being grandfathered in doesn’t change that. “Technically, it’s legal” won’t win you any sympathy points.

        • LuesDE@alien.topB
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          10 months ago

          And? It doesn’t matter how they were founded 100 years ago. Nowadays they are part of the Bayer AG and are one of three (soon to be two) clubs who are exempt from the 50+1 rule.

        • J-LG@alien.topB
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          10 months ago

          I am not German so maybe I am missing something but I can’t really see the equivalence between Wolfsburg and Leverkusen against Hoffenheim and Leipzig. The former were initiated as clubs for the workers of the companies about 100 years ago, the latter two were bought by SAP and RB, respectively. I don’t think it makes sense to see Wolfsburg and Leverkusen in the same light given that their history is deeply intertwined with the corporations that own them, the people of those corporations and the cities they are in.

          It’s absolutely normal to me that Wolfsburg and Bayer are owned by their respective Groups, even with the German rule of ownership.

          Edit: obviously this ultra message from OP is horrendous and i’m not defending it all btw

          • Conankun66@alien.topB
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            10 months ago

            I am not German so maybe I am missing something but I can’t really see the equivalence between Wolfsburg and Leverkusen against Hoffenheim and Leipzig

            in general the two broad categories of german clubs are “tradtionsclub”(tradition club) and “Kommerzclub” (commercial club, the plastics).

            we do make further distinctions within that second category (Leipzig is seen as by far the worst, then hoffenheim and then wolfsburg and leverkusen) but what they all share is that they are controlled privately and undermine 50+1, so they are grouped together as plastic

            • J-LG@alien.topB
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              10 months ago

              I see, that’s interesting. Thanks for the cultural context, makes sense.

              • TheTimon@alien.topB
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                10 months ago

                They still have a big financial advantage for not being owned by the fans but by Bayer AG a ethicly dubious company at the least. Fans just don’t like that, they take away a spot in the bundesliga from Fan-Owned Clubs, they take away International campaings from Clubs who would actually fill their stadium in these international games, who could actually use the money. All 4 clubs make the leage worse.

    • mana-addict4652@alien.topB
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      10 months ago

      Bremen and Koln

      of course lol

      Every right-wing ultras group hates those clubs. Respectively, they’re seen as the “woke club” and “gay club” by the far-right ultras.

      • ovenimz@alien.topB
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        10 months ago

        Köln is actually due to the proximity. Bremen however doesn’t make any sense whatsoever, their fans can’t really be generalised as leaning towards any political affiliation.

        • moosknauel@alien.topB
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          10 months ago

          Not sure what your source is but Bremen Ultras are very, very left leaning.
          The club itself is also a bit more left leaning just look at the AFD statements.

          In 2007 there was an attack on the antirascist Ultra Group Racaille by far right Hooligans at a party inside the stadiums east curve hall. Back at that time most fans were like you said trying to be unpolitical and to avoid any conflicts but there was also the first root of leftist fan groups and anti-rascist, anti-homophobic etc. fan groups coming up.

          This attack lead to a change in our fan scene but since then the majority of our ultra scene has been very far left leaning and the Hooligan Groups have been driven out of the stadium.

          Of course there is no generalisation of normal fans. I do know someone with very right wing views whos St. Pauli fan but in general our fan scene right now and especially the ultras are left leaning.

    • Available_Bathroom_4@alien.topB
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      10 months ago

      LOL everybody in Bremen laughs about that every season, Werder is NOT A RIVAL of Leverkusen, it’s just that their ultras try desperately to start a quarrel with the mainly leftist leaning ultra groups with tame provocations like this one.

      • alamur@alien.topB
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        10 months ago

        Hertha Fans try the same with us in Schalke and other Schalke Fans are always super confused because nobody cares about Hertha Berlin.

        • callmeeismann@alien.topB
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          10 months ago

          Setting aside the fact that I find club friendships and rivalries in general super random and mostly ridiculous, this one has some history. Old Hertha fans remember Schalke using lawyer power to strip Hertha of a crushing 3:0 win in the 71/72 DFB Pokal, after which Schalke went on to win the Pokal that season.