He’s the leftwing outsider who nearly became the Democrats’ candidate for president - twice. As his position on the Israel-Gaza war threatens to upset his support, the veteran senator says he’s tired but determined to fight the return of that ‘ bitter, humiliated man’
  • TheKingBee@lemmy.worldEnglish
    0·
    6 months ago

    If trump wins and America can’t defeat his senile version of fascism, then it’s already on the death bed waiting for the next republican to take power…

    trump is the best authoritarian we’re going to get, he’s easy mode, the republicans will get someone worse, someone who has the ability to think beyond his next shit.

    It’s not going to get better only worse…

  • quitenormal@lemmy.world
    0·
    6 months ago

    I know you mrrrkns absolutely hate it when furriners’ talk about your politics, but it saddens me to see a fellow democracy in such a state. Both these guys are demented old f&@ks! These are the best candidates your democratic system can give you? Really? I know we Aussies have plenty to cringe about, but jeez!

  • chetradley@lemmy.world
    0·
    6 months ago

    I was proud to vote for Bernie in the 2016 and 2020 primaries, but I bit the bullet and phone banked for Biden even though he was far from my first choice. There’s way too much at stake here.

    • return2ozma@lemmy.worldOP
      0·
      6 months ago

      I volunteered for Sanders campaign but didn’t do anything for Biden. He didn’t earn my vote. Democracy at work.

    • Blackbeard@lemmy.worldEnglish
      0·
      6 months ago

      Man, it’s crazy how similar that sounds to exactly what Biden has been saying all along:

      And I’ve said many times before: I believe we’re at an inflection point in this country — one of those moments where the decisions we’re about to make can change — literally change the trajectory of our nation for years and possibly decades to come.

      Each inflection point in this nation’s history represents a fundamental choice. I believe that America, at this moment, is facing such a choice. And the choice is this: Are we going to continue with an economy where the overwhelming share of the benefits go to big corporations and the very wealthy? Or are we going to take this moment right now to set this country on a new path — one that invests in this nation; creates real, sustained economic growth; and that benefits everyone, including working people and middle-class folks?

      That’s something we haven’t realized in this country for decades.

      Here’s the simple truth. For a long time, this economy has worked great for those at the very top, while ordinary, hardworking Americans — the people who built this country — have been basically cut out of the deal.

      And I’ve said this from the time I announced I was going to run: I believe this is a moment of potentially great change. This is our moment to deal working people back into the economy. This is our moment to prove to the American people that their government works for them, not just for the big corporations and those at the very top.

      Yet an off-the-cuff remark about asking wealthy people to accept slightly higher taxes is somehow all his breathless detractors want to pretend has ever existed.

      • crusa187@lemmy.ml
        0·
        6 months ago

        Actions speak louder than words. Biden locked in Trump’s $2T tax cuts for the rich and corporations, bringing the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21%. Never mind the open loopholes they exploit to pay virtually nothing anyway. Then, Biden claims he wants to bump up the corporate tax rate to 28%, but can’t, for “reasons.”

        What is this halfway corpo-fascist stance? How are we going to pay for that?! By cutting social programs meant to support the working class. Biden is full of shit on this issue, open your eyes.

      • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world
        0·
        6 months ago

        Man, it’s crazy how similar that sounds to exactly what Biden has been saying all along:

        I get your frustration, but this is a good thing. Bernie having the same message only strengthens it, and can convince people that won’t listen to Biden.

        We don’t have the luxury of picking allies. If holding my tongue gets us a reluctant ally, I’ll take it. None of us have to like each other. We just need to remember that fascism is the ultimate evil. We may bicker like dwarves and elves, but when the orcs appear, we need to fall lockstep shoulder to shoulder immediately.

    • donuts@kbin.social
      0·
      6 months ago

      … which, if you really feel that way, is exactly why we need to implement more democratic and efficient voting systems, like ranked choice (instant runoff),, STAR, approval, etc.

      As American political systems are today, the only viable candidates to win the presidency in 2024 are Joe Biden (a well-meaning, old white man) and Donald Trump (old white narcissistic Putin-loving vindictive criminal rapist who doesn’t care for democracy and can’t remember his wife’s name).

      I’ll be voting for Biden because even if you really believe he’s “evil”, he’s certainly the far lesser evil than Trump (for the reasons listed above and then some).

      • Imgonnatrythis@sh.itjust.works
        0·
        6 months ago

        I’m not going to hold it against Biden for being old and white. All for moving toward equality but I’d be willing to give anyone a chance if they have some ideas (like an actual platform) and some drive to make some positive change. It’s more the fact that Biden seems slightly demented and acts like a prototypical old white man stereotype that worries me. Of course I’m not even going to talk about the alternative though, the choice should be simple here given the options but it’s a depressing choice either way.

      • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
        0·
        6 months ago

        What fuckin crazypants logic is this

        “Well what I have is way far away from what I want, so what’s the point in choosing the clearly better alternative”

        As applied to this particular election, this is like saying “I want to climb this mountain, but the hill in front of me isn’t where I want to get to, it’s like thousands of feet lower than the summit, so what’s the difference if I jump into this ravine filled with lava instead”

        Also what happened to that video call where you offered to prove that you were who you say you are? Not a right-wing shill posting anti-Biden things to discourage Democrats from voting?

        • NocturnalMorning@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          It’s not crazy, it’s true. Trump wants a full on fascist system, there’s no denying it. But we definitely don’t have a democracy. Corporations and billionaires run the country. That’s not even touching on the fact that most democrats don’t want Biden for a second term, but the DNC is going to force it on us anyway.

          • donuts@kbin.social
            0·
            6 months ago

            That’s not even touching on the fact that most democrats don’t want Biden for a second term, but the DNC is going to force it on us anyway.

            Well, you might say that, but when Biden is winning with >90% as a write-in candidate in primaries where he isn’t even on the ballot, it’s a little bit hard to take it seriously.

            There is no serious or viable candidate challenging Biden from the left in 2024, which is why Bernie is out here endorsing him. To pragmatic socialists like Bernie, electing Biden isn’t the destination, but the next necessary step to keeping the country on the right path and defending against an existential threat to our democracy. Don’t take it from me though, read what he’s been saying.

        • return2ozma@lemmy.worldOP
          0·
          6 months ago

          I decided you’re obsessed with me and I don’t want to doxx myself by giving you my contact info. Go through my reddit history if you want. I’m not a right winger. Same username as here

          • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
            0·
            6 months ago

            Would you say you’re obsessed with Biden, and how it’s important for people not to vote for him in this election? You post about him way more than I engage with your stuff. And yes, I still think it’s sus for a couple of different reasons. That’s not obsessive, any more than noting from time to time “yo you should be aware, that dude at the bus stop seems like he’s acting weird” is obsessing over that dude at the bus stop.

            Not doing anything to “prove” who you are seems perfectly reasonable, of course. You were the one who suggested that somewhat odd idea, and then fell silent when I said, sure sounds good, I am curious. But by all means, you do you, keep your privacy, that seems better regardless.

            Also, saying you can’t be a shill because you had an account on Reddit is like saying “I can’t have sand on me, I live at the beach.”

            • return2ozma@lemmy.worldOP
              0·
              6 months ago

              Ah yes, I’m such a right wing shill that I posted an article titled… ‘It will be the end of democracy’: Bernie Sanders on what happens if Trump wins – and how to stop him

              Everybody should be critical of our politicians. Hold their feet to the fire. Always.

              • mozz@mbin.grits.dev
                0·
                6 months ago

                Critical is one thing – I actually was convinced recently by Ezra Klein’s editorial and Jon Stewart’s episode that there are significant reasons to try to put someone other than Biden up in the general election. Why is that? Because they made serious, sensible arguments and seemed genuinely concerned about the future of the country. They didn’t say grossly irresponsible things like that there’s no difference between Trump and Biden, or give reasons people shouldn’t vote in the election. They actually expressed the urgency of what’s going to happen in this election as a key reason why it’s important to take problems with Biden seriously.

                If you were posting things coming at it from that perspective, I’d have no reason to be suspicious of your motives in posting this stuff.

                Ah yes, I’m such a right wing shill that I posted an article titled

                Yes, your MO seems to be a certain percent generically left-wing things, sort of the minimum required to maintain a fig-leaf of general political interest outside of your clear agenda, combined with a heavy percentage of just pure single-issue anti-Biden propaganda. Your most recent 10 articles show the ratio at 30%/70%. The fact that this is one of the 30% doesn’t excuse the 70%, to me.

                • return2ozma@lemmy.worldOP
                  0·
                  6 months ago

                  I do try to post negative Trump articles too but then have to delete them as it’s a duplicate post already. The sub, or whatever they’re called, already has the anti-Trump articles on lock.

    • snownyte@kbin.social
      0·
      6 months ago

      Here’s the reality - it’s been 171 years since we’ve last seen a third party take presidency.

      I repeat - 171 years! If you’re still foolish to think that this year is the year or foolish then to think that 2020 and 2016 were the years for the Independent Party. All that you’re doing is just wasting effort and time going out in the voter’s booth and voting Independent just for a self-pat on the back.

      • donuts@kbin.social
        0·
        6 months ago

        I’ll add that the only, and i’ll say it again, ONLY, viable path to 3rd party success in this country is through more democratic voting system reforms. (ranked-choice, STAR, approval, etc.)

        Anyone who doesn’t understand this is either ignorant, stupid, or playing dumb for sophistry and manipulation’s sake.

      • Uranium3006@kbin.social
        0·
        6 months ago

        I’m writing in “free Palestine” for president this November thanks to this comment condescending about it

        • PugJesus@kbin.social
          0·
          6 months ago

          “Wow, someone online pointed out that the majority of people supporting two shitty candidates is still democracy! Because of that, I’m gonna do my best to make sure the guy who wants MORE genocide gets in office! That’ll really help anyone who isn’t a rich cis white conservative Christian male!”

            • acceptable_pumpkin@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              No, it’s people like you who will cause Trump to win. Not the DNC, but people who stupidly throw away their votes or vote Trumpnjust out of spite.

              You’re either a shill or completely naive on how the world works.

    • donuts@kbin.social
      0·
      6 months ago

      Trump doesn’t seem to really care whether he wins or not, just in case you haven’t noticed…

      Just like last time, he’ll claim that he’s won if he’s ever even slightly ahead, and he and his cult will harass people to “stop the count”.

      Just like last time, he and his cult will resort to violence and insurrection to overthrow democracy even if he loses.

    • gregorum@lemm.eeEnglish
      0·
      6 months ago

      Like Hitler, who was democratically elected before ending democracy in Germany?

      Yes, exactly.

        • John_McMurray@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          I mean parliamentary countries say their head of government, say their leader is elected, but it’s just short for the “majority party has a leader”. There’s no requirement in my country for the head of government to actually have an elected seat, it’s just tradition the head of the party has one. Usually if the leader has no seat, a member in a “safe” riding resigns and he gets a seat that way, or alternatively, appoints himself to the Senate. The person doesn’t actually have to do either, head of government is a cabinet position, not a parliamentary position. Speaker and house leader cover that in parliament.

      • Ranvier@sopuli.xyz
        0·
        6 months ago

        Hitler wasn’t directly elected. Hindenburg won the election vs Hitler for president in 1932, then later Hindenburg appointed Hitler as chancellor after nazis became the largest party in the Reichstag. Hitler got to work using nazis and other right wing parties in parliament to pass laws to give more powers to himself (using excuses like the Reichstag fire), and then later usurped presidential powers as well after Hindenburg’s death.

        But your point still stands, democracies have failed before and America isn’t immune to that. It could happen in America too. And some of Trump’s plans in 2020 and his plans for 2024 are very similar to the nazi playbook. They kind of tried to pull a Reichstag fire on January 6th by blaming antifa or the deep state or whatever crazy conspiracy theory they cooked up to try and distract from their failed coup.

    • PugJesus@kbin.social
      0·
      6 months ago

      It’s a good thing no one who was ever democratically elected dismantled democracy so they could never lose the power they gained.

      • blazera@kbin.social
        0·
        6 months ago

        1, he’s been elected before, yet we’ve still got our election system. 2, democrats are actually trying to dismantle democracy by denying a huge number of voters the ability to vote for their choice for president. Dont by hypocritical, flip the roles around and imagine Trump or republican states are the ones barring Biden from running. It’s not gonna sit well with you is it?

        Democracies mean the people decide, even if that goes against who you want to win.

        • PugJesus@kbin.social
          0·
          6 months ago

          1, he’s been elected before, yet we’ve still got our election system.

          Did you forget January 6th? It’s not for lack of trying that our election system remained intact through a Trump presidency.

          Dont by hypocritical, flip the roles around and imagine Trump or republican states are the ones barring Biden from running. It’s not gonna sit well with you is it?

          Of course it wouldn’t. Because Biden running would not be contrary to the Constitution, unlike Trump, whose candidacy is a clear violation of the 14th. The rule of law should apply to everyone - not just the poor.

        • BigWheelPowerBrakeSlider@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          If Biden committed the acts and, as of now alleged crimes Trump has been accused of, then Biden would need to be barred too. That’s the difference with Trump supporters, the rest of us want the laws applied no matter which “team” the politician represents. It’s people over party and not the other way around.

          • blazera@kbin.social
            0·
            6 months ago

            as of now alleged crimes Trump has been accused of

            Thats the issue. Innocent until proven guilty. I believe he’s guilty, but for setting legal precedent this makes accusations enough to bar a candidate in an election.

            • BigWheelPowerBrakeSlider@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              But also my understanding is there’s nothing in the law requiring criminal conviction for sedition or insurrection or whatever the proper term is. I’m not sure who is supposed to be the determiner of fact. I think that’s why several of the states took it upon themselves. Hence why SCOTUS is almost certainly going to have to determine some of these issues. But I also could be talking out my ass.

    • AndOfTheSevenSeas@lemmy.world
      0·
      6 months ago

      You have to remember that a large swath of (generally) younger people are wildly misinformed/uninformed on the actual power of the presidency. They have the idea that the president can universally override all powers of the other branches at any given time and/or that both other branches will be captured (conveniently while a given dictator-to-be is in office) in a significant enough way that whatever piece of legislation the president outrightly wants, they will receive.

      • JasonDJ@lemmy.zip
        0·
        6 months ago

        A lot of people act like the president has unilateral power, not just younger people.

        He doesn’t, there’s checks and balances in Congress and the courts.

        But the courts are stacked and Congress is pretty closely split by which side of history their members have historically been on.

  • AutoTL;DR@lemmings.worldBEnglish
    0·
    6 months ago

    This is the best summary I could come up with:

    There are posters from different stages in his political life, including an inevitable “Feel the Bern” placard and a photograph from Puerto Cabezas, Nicaragua, which mayor Sanders twinned Burlington with during Ronald Reagan’s Contra war against the leftwing Sandinistas.

    He also dedicates the book to his brother, Larry Sanders, who lives in Oxford, England, and is a former Green party councillor, and to his four children – one by his first wife, Deborah Shiling Messing, and three stepchildren, who are Jane’s but whom he considers his own – as well as to those seven grandchildren.

    With his index finger jabbing as though pointing to an invisible crowd, he tells me that before the pandemic three multibillionaires (Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates and Warren Buffett) owned more between them than the combined wealth of the 160 million Americans who make up the bottom half of society.

    More than 400 of his former staffers signed an open letter imploring him to shift his position; one of them, his 2020 campaign spokesperson, Briahna Joy Gray, tweeted “biggest political disappointment of our generation” in response to an interview in which Sanders explained his view.

    For all his talk of revolution, for all his tax-the-rich bills and declarations of radical populism, a large part of the Sanders creed is nothing more nor less than an appeal for the basic fundamentals of life – health, housing, a living wage, education – that are taken for granted by all other developed nations.

    Is there a danger many young Americans and voters of colour who formed a critical part of the coalition that elected Biden – and defeated Trump – in 2020 will look at the rematch of the same two candidates in November, decide they aren’t inspired by either, and stay at home?

    The original article contains 3,677 words, the summary contains 295 words. Saved 92%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!

        • Jimmyeatsausage@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          Or…and hear me out…sane people know that murdering those you disagree with is authoritarianism regardless or right- or left- wing window dressing you apply.

        • Billiam@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          Well, yeah, unfortunately.

          For the record, I am absolutely not advocating for another Civil War. I’m pointing out that there are lots of gun owners who don’t make firearm ownership their entire identity, and those people by-and-large aren’t Trump worshipping accelerationists.

  • WarmSoda@lemm.ee
    0·
    6 months ago

    Don’t forget, Sanders is the only person Trump has ever admitted he’s afraid of.

    • lennybird@lemmy.worldEnglish
      0·
      6 months ago

      Take with a grain of salt, considering Putin says Biden is better for him than Trump. While I don’t necessarily agree with the argument, Republicans (and centrist dems) certainly believe Sanders would’ve been an easy target for smear campaigns.

      • Tinidril@midwest.socialEnglish
        0·
        6 months ago

        Trump was an easy target for smear campaigns. That’s why Hillary’s campaign helped Trump win the primary, and that sure worked out well.

        Americans don’t give two shits about what the neolibs think are devastating attacks. They are fed up with the out-of-touch wealthy and political classes.

    • givesomefucks@lemmy.worldEnglish
      0·
      6 months ago

      Dems really underestimate what life is like for normal Americans. trump doesn’t get it either obviously, but at least he acknowledges shit is bad for them.

      If Biden tries to run in the economy it’s going to hurt him because all the money is going to the wealthy.

      Bernie acknowledges and actually has a plan to fix shit. And unlike trump points the finger at whose fault it is.

      trump can’t compete with that.

      But neoliberals don’t want to really address wealth inequality either.

        • ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          Biden is the only thing standing between democracy and fascism in the US. Hate it all you want,but that is the reality at the moment.

          • Doc Avid Mornington@midwest.socialEnglish
            0·
            6 months ago

            He can play two roles, it’s not as simple as either good or bad. Capitalist Democratic leadership that is dedicated more to controlling the party’s left wing than defeating the country’s extremist right wing has and does enable fascism. This isn’t even a remotely controversial take, historically speaking. Trump owes his first presidency to the likes of Clinton and Obama, and yes, Joe Biden, who had had a long career of neoliberalism.

            That said, while Biden hasn’t been, by any means, a perfect president, he has been far better than I expected, possibly the most progressive president since LBJ. And he is standing, albeit somewhat vaguely, between Trump and the Whitehouse.

            But stopping Trump isn’t going to stop the slide into fascism. It can only, at best, delay things until the next election. To do that, we need a strong progressive movement to send a true leftist coalition to take over DC, and set a national tone and direction that moves away from the fascist ledge.

            • SupahRevs@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              But Biden has not stayed on the neo-liberal hard line globalist policies. He has recoiled from international supply chains by bringing investment to manufacturing in the US. He has relieved debt payments for college educated workers. He has invested in infrastructure for transportation of goods as well as electricity which tackles the problem of emissions as well as cost of energy. I believe these moves are a reaction to understanding that life is hard and globalism left a lot of people behind.

            • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              I think the irony is that Republicans are both as dangerous and fragile as possible right now. Their coalition is fracturing badly. If we win definitively in November, it will be a strong blow against them. If we’re lucky, it’ll be enough to permanently splinter them and make them unviable nationally.

              That is my first and foremost goal. Render them impotent.

            • ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              I’m usually all about finding a middle ground, but in this election it is that simple. Trump brings fascism now. Biden retains democracy for at least another 4 years.

          • chakan2@lemmy.worldEnglish
            0·
            6 months ago

            Biden isn’t standing between anything…he’s a speed bump. We still lost our reproductive rights, Trump’s tax cuts are still in place, we are still sending money to Israel and not the Ukraine.

            Biden sucks. Don’t vote for Trump…but god it’s fucking depressing that the only alternative is a guy with Alzheimer’s and a meme army for political clout.

            • ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              We lost our reproductive rights because of judges Trump installed. Biden has no power to change that. Trump’s tax cuts were passed by Congress and can only be undone by Congress, not Biden. Your criticism of Biden’s actions regarding Israel is justified, but let’s not pretend Trump wouldn’t be much worse. Yeah, Biden is old but he is more coherent and aware now than Trump was 20 years ago.

              I wasn’t enthusiastic about Biden last election, but he has easily been the most effective president of my lifetime. He got us out of COVID without the economy crashing. He put hundreds of millions into mental health counselors for schools. He massively accelerated our shift to renewable energy. He has put major efforts into domestic microchip production. He put limits on insulin costs. He got a national electric vehicle charging network funded. He got funding passed for infrastructure improvements including bridges, tunnels, and broadband expansion. He has increased our defenses against cyber attacks and extended political channels for addressing them around the world. He has created more than 800,000 new jobs and gotten 6 million more people healthcare coverage. He passed legislation creating a 15% minimum tax rate on billion dollar corporations.

              https://navigatorresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/October-24-Few-Have-Heard-1280x720.jpg

            • Xanis@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              The difference is one has caved to public pressure and kept many promises. The other creates negative public-cult sentiment and keeps no promises.

              Yes, it’s frustrating only having these choices right now. However, it is important to point out that we still have choices. People with sentiment just like yours, with a footnote that says “Not gonna vote, because [insert reason here].” are a part of the problem, when they could become a part of the start of a solution. One years, and probably a couple election cycles long, yet still potentially a positive way forward.

            • Socsa@sh.itjust.works
              0·
              6 months ago

              You lost your reproductive rights because a bunch of Sanders bros decided they’d rather let Trump win than vote for Hillary.

                • Socsa@sh.itjust.works
                  0·
                  6 months ago

                  Over what exactly? The only lawsuit the Sanders campaign filed was over a misunderstanding over how a DNC voter database was configured. Both candidates had access to the same modeling and turnout software, and the Sanders campaign was mistakenly able to access data and models Clinton had generated because the system was not configured correctly. He sued when that mistake was corrected, but quickly dropped the suit when the issue was clarified.

                  The lawsuit against Wasserman-Shultz was from a voter group, and it was dismissed. Maybe I’m missing one though. Can you jog my memory?

                • Socsa@sh.itjust.works
                  0·
                  6 months ago

                  I mean I still literally see tons of people on the internet who are salty about it and openly use 2016 as an excuse to not vote for Democrats. Granted, a portion of these people were trolls then and are trolls now, but the sentiment is too common to dismiss.

                  And whether or not it is true, it should still be a cautionary tale in pragmatism. I personally voted (and volunteered) for Bernie, but then fought for Clinton because it was plainly obvious what was on the line. I just wish more people had fought for Roe, if not for Clinton at that time, instead of waiting for the obvious outcome to get engaged. And it makes me see red to think that we are about to walk right into the exact same, easily preventable trap

          • HardNut@lemmy.world
            0·
            6 months ago

            Please stop being so dramatic, you shouldn’t be afraid to talk to other people about their political opinions.

            • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              It’s not fear, it’s that no one wants to read the same half assed logic that boils down to actively supporting efforts of conservatives to put Trump back in power. This shit strategy is getting old.

              The winner of the 2024 general election for POTUS will be Donald Trump or Joe Biden. In a FPTP system any eligible vote not cast for Joe Biden is supporting Donald Trump, a member of the minority party. This is math. You are going to support one of these candidates if you’re eligible to vote. It is mathematically impossible to sit out and not have influence.

              Not a single one of the commenters trying to depress Democratic votes has provided a single alternative argument to these facts. It’s not a real argument. It’s just trying to create apathy so conservatives can gain more power.

              You can talk about Democratic principles all day long, voting is a strategic play. And if you were actually trying to defend Democratic principles you would take the action that results in the least harm, which is Joe Biden, not Donald Trump.

              • HardNut@lemmy.world
                0·
                6 months ago

                You are discussing strategy to avoid the most harm. Harm avoidance. That’s fear. You are literally describing fear without using the word fear and acting like I was the one misunderstanding. You need to understand that you are acting on fear. It’s ridiculous, and I was right to point it out.

                You mentioned my other comment in passing like it meant nothing to you, then say that no one hear has given any real arguments? Maybe you just need to read in better faith. You clearly don’t have any respect for my concerns with Biden if your comment demonstrates a complete unwillingness to even entertain the thought.

                Canadian btw, you don’t need to convince of anything to do with voting strategy anyway. Wasted energy. I just think you guys are being really silly and can’t see the forest from the trees. You could probably use third party observers to get your heads on straight.

                • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
                  0·
                  6 months ago

                  Zero interest in trying to convince you of anything. I just want everyone else to understand that listening to you acts against their own interests. Either you don’t understand how our electoral system works, or you’re misleading people to try and put your thumb on the scale in support of some pretty horrible people.

                  Waiting anytime for an explanation of how Trump getting elected benefits the situation in Gaza btw. Or do we not care about that now because that would be acting out of fear?

            • WarmSoda@lemm.ee
              0·
              6 months ago

              I was being rhetorical. Please stop reading everything people say as black and white ones and zeros.

              • HardNut@lemmy.world
                0·
                6 months ago

                I know you were being rhetorical. Your rhetoric is pathetic. Please stop assuming people have misunderstood just because they don’t like what you say.

        • Jimmyeatsausage@lemmy.world
          0·
          6 months ago

          You’re missing a crucial part of that process I think. Milquetoast candidates can cause voter apathy, yes. It’s the apathy that helps fascism.