All the ingredients are there and it won’t take much to put it all together.
There is a movie coming out in a few months about a US Civil War: https://youtu.be/aDyQxtg0V2w?si=oRudiMaKVQmBy2R_
Oof, that was more chilling than I expected.
Nice, A24. I’ll see that one in the theaters!
My country is going through a civil war right now.
The US is nowhere near close. You’ll be fine.
Where are you from?
Sudan
Civil War? No. What is possible and already happening at State levels is following the direction of Hungry. Authoritarian judges, politicians are being installed across the US and progressive and even moderate laws being challenged. Roe vs Wade comes to mind. On the federal level we see the installment of far right federal judges and Supreme Court justices. All coming together to help install far right authoritarian in the executive and legislative branches. Yes, socially, Americans have been more divided in the past, but this time there’s is a deliberate attempt to change the governance of US from the inside through brute force.
You don’t need the USA to be involved for a World War to start. If anything, a civil war in the USA could help spark one.
The peace built after World War II was mainly founded on American and Soviet force not intervening with each other, then American military dominance. Without a USA like power acting as a guarantor of the current international system, it is very likely that decades of pent up aggression will start to spill forward across the globe, including between other major powers.
I mean, the gravy seals may try and overthrow the government again in 2024, but they’ll be embarrassingly squashed within a half a day.
For there to be a civil war there needs to be an army on both sides.
There isn’t
Yeah, somehow all my gun-owning friends get all awkward and quiet when I ask them how it’s gonna feel to shoot at the 18yo army recruits and national guard when they finally “come for their guns.” I haven’t even gotten to ask what anti-drone measures they have.
Not one of them is ready for the realities of a shooting war with the American Military.
I haven’t even gotten to ask what anti-drone measures they have.
The answer will be “none” because unless they’re ex-military, their entire contribution to any militia is usually “gun”.
Most of them wouldn’t pass fitness requirements nor take orders. Few of them have other skills such as first aid, communication tech or drone piloting.
Even when contributing their gun, you can’t assume they know how to safely and usefully handle a weapon, or that they’re mentally fit for combat, because none of that is a requirement for buying a gun.
It’s a hero fantasy they’ve literally never thought critically about, but it’s supposed to make all the mass shootings worth it.
I’m afraid you’re the one living the fantasy. Of course many of these idiots are exactly as you say. But have you been around such people?
Or are you basing your opinion on the pictures we see on the internet? The pictures thrown out there and made popular because of how foolish they make these people seem?
I’m begging you all, please don’t be so dismissive and naive.
I get off-topic for this post towards the end, fit better in the original reply:
Y’all, please, we gotta stop pretending these guys are fat losers.
Right after 01/06 I was at a gun show and bought an old army canteen off a guy. 35-40, fit, military demeanor, all that. As I was walking off, another guy saw something that clued him in that the vendor was an Oath Keeper and they had a low-key chat. He talked about their preparations! Fucking terrorist.
My neighbor is still flying his Trump flag high. Proper flagpole, well lit, all that. Young man, fit, ex-military demeanor. I refuse to speak to him, and never will. No one else has an issue with this! They are meek and complicit.
His next-door neighbor was a former friend of mine. Again, 37 and fit as hell, but not military. First night I met him he told us his brothers were at 01/06. I gave the FBI what I knew, which wasn’t much. This guy is a smart, reasonable man, and while not a supporter, still will not disavow Trump.
I’m 52, fairly fit, well-armed and practiced. I shoot every weekend at my camp for fun. Shotguns, various pistols and rifles, I shoot it all. I’m no expert, but I can shoot better than your average bear. If it came down to brass tacks, and we were equally armed, I seriously doubt I could prevail against any of those 3 men.
For the love of god, please get armed, learn safety and practice. FFS, the GOP front-runner is speaking more and more radically. He just called me “vermin” that must be eradicated. He’s speaking of “internal enemies”. He means you. And it’s not just his usual inane rhetoric, look up Project 2025. It a fleshed-out plan to take over the executive branch and impose their will.
What the fuck will it take to get libs off their ass and prepare?! Harsh words and votes are not gonna suffice if Trump gets back in. I fully expect my neighbors to come knocking once Brown Shirts are authorized. Committee of Public Safety anyone?
“Look man, we understand you don’t agree, and that’s all good, but we gotta take your guns for your own safety. Trust us, you’ll be OK, just hand 'em over.”
Your country and your very life may be on the line soon. And yes, fighting back may mean your personal extinction. But that was in the cards anyway.
As best I can figure, the majority on the left are completely unaware of how dangerous things have gotten over the last few years. Unless you’re living in it, most people see it as histrionics.
We live in the deep south in what used to be an island of relative progressiveness. I have acquaintances that joined the three percenters, know former military spouting Q shit. Lost the only man I ever called brother to the insanity. Things have CHANGED in the last few years.
Our friend circle has shrunk and we no longer talk to our neighbors.
We’re moving to the northeast this summer. There’s a very real chance that it won’t be safe for us here much longer.
Like you, we’re armed and also realize that it likely won’t be enough.
History doesn’t repeat itself, but it sure does rhyme. The smart Jews with means got the fuck out of Germany before things popped off. We can’t afford to leave the country but hopefully we’ll land somewhere safer.
Hope nothing happens and all the worry has been for nothing. I really want to be wrong.
The left is clueless. I was there not long ago!
They think with enough “gotchas!” and revelations of hypocrisy they can win hearts and minds. Nah. We’re miles past that. Miles past logic, truth and talking rationally.
Things have indeed changed radically. My guess is that many liberals are missing it because they’re in their own little political bubble. Imagine trying to convince someone from Washington State or San Francisco how crazy it’s become.
Anyway, I don’t have the money to run, and don’t wish to. I’ll stay and fight for America if it comes to that. I’m middle-aged, and have had a full life, so that’s not bravado speaking.
I have a wife, daughter, and son. My daughter is queer. My son is a teen. There isn’t a future here for them. My daughter, especially, will be in danger.
I’ve had to cut all contact with my family.
We’ve been saving since 2020.
If it was just me, I’d stay.
I pass as a bearded white guy good ol boy. The shit I hear. These people aren’t coming back. Even if nothing happens with the next election, I don’t know how they rejoin reality.
I don’t know what happens to this country. I kind of hope there is a bloodless balkanization.
Man, this hit home for me. I’m a queer woman and I know my dad worries about me tremendously. I don’t really have anything to add to the conversation, just wanted to comment. Hopefully things won’t get too bad…
The states have armies. That is the national guard. Some states have defense forces as well.
So if we have a civil war, there are plenty of armies to go around.
I hear lots of rumblings about a civil war but I don’t think we are close to one. You hear it from all sides. California wants to leave. Texas wants to lead. East Oregon wants to join Idaho.
I just see people bitching as they always do.
While I may dislike my current president. I’m not going to pick up a rifle for any of these jokers to try to change my government. Overall our system works. Something drastic would have to happen to change my mind.
Do the states have aircraft carriers?
No but Missouri has nuclear weapons. Thank Ike Skelton for that.
131st bomb wing
First of all, disclaimer, I’m just a random weirdo on the internet. I don’t have a law degree, I’m not a politician. I’m probably naked and masturbating while writing this.
Are we going to have a Civil War 2: Now With More F150’s where it’s the north vs the south? No.
Are we going to reach a point where the US sort of falls apart into separate little countries after a lot of unpleasantness? I’m not as confident in saying “No”.
I think what will happen first is less “civil war” and more “societal collapse”. There are very few places in the US where someone can rent an apartment by themselves, and have a decent life with nice hobbies, while only having one income. Buying a house by yourself is even farther out of reach.
But I am noticing something that is a lot closer to everyone than real estate: food is getting expensive. A hamburger at a fast food joint used to be a quick and cheap, although not healthy, way to get lunch, but now a combo meal basically anywhere is $15. For one person. So cook at home, right? Ignoring the difficulties of cooking for oneself after working both jobs, or working all day at one job, that isn’t much cheaper. Making a healthy meal for yourself and your family is a skill that not everyone has, and groceries aren’t cheap either. I think the first thing that is going to happen is going to be mass food theft, followed by food riots. It’s already starting in fact, how many memes have popped up with variations on the saying “If you see someone stealing food, no you didn’t”? Stealing food from a large company is acceptable for a lot of people. With rising COL, we will approach a point where a majority of people cannot afford food, and food isn’t a house or a shiny new car. Food isn’t a choice.
There will be hysterical articles in NYT about how these poor struggling retailers are losing SO MUCH money (but not really) from theft, and you’ll start seeing two squad cars parked outside of every grocery store and walmart - even in “nice” areas.
And that’s where things will start to escalate. Not everyone likes police now, and seeing a neighbor thrown on the ground and arrested, if not just killed, in walmart because she was trying to get food for her family isn’t going to make them more popular. One or two cops cannot fend off everyone in a walmart. Oh, the cops have guns? That’s adorable, so do some people in a walmart. Political feelings about police won’t matter when it’s your stomach growling, when it’s your children going hungry.
I expect this would be the point where food would get locked up, only distributed by employees. Which would make it cost more, and more time consuming to acquire. There will be lines. There will also be people who will grow food - but not everyone can do that, and I’m cynical enough to think that some locales will pass laws against “backyard farming” in the name of “food safety”, pushed by grocery stores trying to get that extra .025% profit this quarter.
What will happen once people can’t get food, will be the local PD being completely unable to enforce anything.
Remember that it’s bread AND circuses.
The US has a pretty severe urban / rural divide in most of its states, but I don’t think it’s enough. You’d usually need a pretty clean split along territorial lines for that.
You don’t need a clean territorial split for a civil war. You just need clean lines of separation between different groups. There have been civil wars based on ethnic lines, religious lines, and even ideologies.
The wars without clear territory get messy. Like genocide messy.
The first Civil War was started when slave states sent squads up north to round up “escaped slaves” which frequently included all black people in a town, even if they’d never been enslaved. The free states tried to stop this, and then the traitors threw a hissy fit and got their shit kicked in.
I can definitely see red states sending cops to arrest women fleeing to get an abortion, and free states trying to stop them and that leading to violence.
The plan has been in motion for a long time. Abolish the police. Decriminalize theft and vandalism. Let millions of people cross over the border with no system of accountability. Call anyone a racist or Hitler who says something that was perfectly normal 10 years ago. Print trillions of dollars that cause inflation while blaming it on greedy businesses and individuals. There are tons of other examples that I don’t have time for. All of these cause major instability. Then when total chaos is at hand and people start rising up, the federal government will declare an emergency and use force to control the population. The COVID controls were just a trial run. They found that they could get enough people to go along with absolutely unconstitutional power grabs, and make anyone making any sense look like a conspiracy nut.
,>make anyone making any sense look like a conspiracy nut.
You’re telling on yourself here that you think conspiracy nuts make sense.
Please leave Lemmy, your kind is not welcome here.
and make anyone making any sense look like a conspiracy nut.
You’re not making any sense and still look like a conspiracy nut. The system must be rigged or something.
You should probably take your meds.
Fucking hell. Take your pills. Like seriously. Get help.
Can’t afford to take the time off work to fight a war. Unless the corporations will sponsor us.
Civil war didn’t happen when Gore “lost” on some technical bullshit, it’s not going to happen anytime soon.
Imagine the libs actually taking up arms. I can’t.
Almost fucking did happen. If the Capitol Riots achieved what they were meant to, it almost certainly would have ended up with civil war, as factions of the government and military would divide between those who saw the coup as it was, and those who believe the big lie. Both of them would see eradicating the other as doing their duty to their country.
Nowadays? it’s still a shitshow but it’s the usual shitshow. It’s moving away from the possibility of civil war.
I sure hope you’re right. If enough of the country hasn’t realized this dude isn’t on their side, we will see a dictatorship unfold, with all the bells and whistles that come with.
Where two groups who are diametrically opposed to one anothers’ ways of life must share a home, war is inevitable.
This. Another Jan 6th is the best we can hope for at this point. If Trump wins, it will be much worse than the first time. If he loses, but wins the coupe, then we get a civil war. I don’t like how 2 of the 3 options are a national shit show as opposed to a failed insurrection (best scenario at this point).
I don’t think Trump has the political capital to stage a successful coup at this point.
Even those that still believe in the big lie would be hesitant to join another coup attempt. They’ve seen how the Jan 6th attempt failed and how the participants have fucked around and found out. Donny did not protect them like they thought he would. Not to mention he only uses his own Truth Social now, which kneecaps his reach when compared to his old Twitter account.
Robert Evans did a great series on how it might play out called “It Could Happen Here.” https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-it-could-happen-here-30717896/episode/the-second-american-civil-war-30751081/
All I’m going to say in regards to any kind of American civil war is this: Whoever fires the first shot loses.
That’s the primary issue everyone is up against. They don’t want to be the ones to fire the first shot because that will justify the national guard being rolled out and a massive escalation.
It’s not going to end well for the loser.
Yes… that is how civil wars occur… Fed vs alternative government…
Yes… that is how you miss the forest for the trees… skipping interesting assertions and waxing philosophical on the definition of civil war
On Jan 6, armies of magats attacked the Capitol Building with the explicit goal of lynching the vice president and Congress. The president was actively targeting the vice president and it was pretty much the premise of like twelve different Gerard Butler movies and is pretty much the reason that we pretend that soldiers are supposed to question the chain of command and so forth.
The military and national guard actively sat on their hands and waited to see how things would shake out. As much as I hate to acknowledge it, the Secret Service and The Boys in Blue are the ones who saved the country that day.
So no. The first shot doesn’t matter and there is no guarantee that there would even be an escalation in the face of a violent insurrection. Because there wasn’t.
